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How To - Tips => Doors => Topic started by: Thumper on July 16, 2014, 10:02:10 AM
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I'm looking for some ideas on how to mount the latch to the inside door frame. I mounted mine and it seems to move slightly, so I ripped it all out and before i start again I was hoping I could get some better ideas/mounting techniques. If you have any pics, please post em up. Maybe I'm overthinking and overbuilding again but I'd rather not have the door fly open going down the road. Thanks in advance!
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Here are some pics, TH. Hope they help. You can see how the reinforcement plate that goes around the latch is welded into the framework at the rear. Jim
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Ahhhhh thank you! Looks like I was on the right track but I didn't put the support beam across the top like you did. Now I can picture where that would stiffen it up significantly.
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The pics above are not my build. I grab any pics on the net to help me build my doors when I get to that point. Here is a pic of my latch supports. One is the vertical and the other is the horizontal. Once the latch is temp mounted to the door inner, I will trim and weld the two pieces together and put it on the inside of the inner with the latch on the outside of the inner. Then I will attach/weld the support to the door frame at the rear. You will also need a strong support behind the striker inside of the quarter panel. (2nd pic) Jim
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My door has a little (maybe half inch to an inch) side to side play at the latch when the door is up. I still need new hinge pins (I think this should cure most of it) but before I take the entire door and hinge off my question is how much play is "normal" or allowed in the door when it's in the fully up position? I'm probably over-thinking again but when I sit inside and pull the door down, I have to be careful that the latch and catch line up when I close it, but they open/close very smoothly. Is this normal or should I keep tweaking to get it as solid as possible? Thanks!
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My door has a little (maybe half inch to an inch) side to side play at the latch when the door is up. I still need new hinge pins (I think this should cure most of it) but before I take the entire door and hinge off my question is how much play is "normal" or allowed in the door when it's in the fully up position? I'm probably over-thinking again but when I sit inside and pull the door down, I have to be careful that the latch and catch line up when I close it, but they open/close very smoothly. Is this normal or should I keep tweaking to get it as solid as possible? Thanks!
I found as little as 1/64" play in the hinge pin bearing will cause almost 1/4" misalignment at the door latch.
You will have to judge for yourself depending on the hinge you use.
The longer (wider) the hinge pin, the better. It is just a matter of distance at length. A small play at a short distance will cause as much misalignment as a bigger play at a longer distance.
For instance: 1/64" (play) at 4" (length of hinge pin) will cause 3/16" movement at 4' 0" (length of door), while 1/64" (play) at 6" (length of hinge pin) will cause 1/8" movement at 4' 0" (length of door).
RT
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RT is exactly correct the wider and tighter the hinge the better end result there will be.
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I'm actually using some door hinges off a '57 Chevy. (see pic). They seem to work really smooth, but I think I found the problem. Not enough metal attached to the inner door just in front of the speaker. The metal is twisting slightly, so I just have to beef it up a little bit and see where it goes from there.
But on real Lambo's I was just wondering how much play is there in the doors?
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Do
I'm actually using some door hinges off a '57 Chevy. (see pic). They seem to work really smooth, but I think I found the problem. Not enough metal attached to the inner door just in front of the speaker. The metal is twisting slightly, so I just have to beef it up a little bit and see where it goes from there.
But on real Lambo's I was just wondering how much play is there in the doors?
Do you have a steel tube inner door frame? With a hinge mounting plate welded to frame?
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RT and Butler nailed it! If there is any flex from the material it is made from you are gonna have a bad time, but most importantly the tighter the tolerance between the hinge pin and the outer bearing surface the less slop there will be! I made my own pins and outer bearing surface and there is a .0005 slip fit between the matting surfaces! There should be uunnoticeable slop in my door as long as it is mounted properly! ::beers
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I'm actually using some door hinges off a '57 Chevy. (see pic). They seem to work really smooth, but I think I found the problem. Not enough metal attached to the inner door just in front of the speaker. The metal is twisting slightly, so I just have to beef it up a little bit and see where it goes from there.
But on real Lambo's I was just wondering how much play is there in the doors?
Any door that uses two hinges spaced apart from each other does not have to be too concerned about the amount of play in the hinge. I'm sure it isn't much but, they are spaced apart effectively making a hinge with a hinge pin about two feet long. On those, once the weight of the door is on the hinges, the door can be adjusted and the door will close accordingly. A single hinge on a Lambo is only about 4" to 6" long. As I stated before, the longer the hinge pin, the less the play effects the other end of the door, where it latches. A Lambo door opening up on one hinge will work smoothly BUT (like you said) ANY side force will cause it to move so much that the latch will not align and the door will slam the latches against each other. NOT GOOD!
So, how much play does a real Lambo hinge have? A real Lambo probably has no perceptible play. The doors close nicely. Just like you would expect on a $300,000 car.
So get the mounting of your hinges SOLID. Take out ALL play in your hinges, even if you have to re-bush and/or re-pin them.
Look for any other reasons why the door flexes. Even look into the door construction.
See how easy these cars are to build?
RT
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I agree, these aren't the easiest (or fun at times) to build. Haha I see what you're saying about the hinge. I think I can get it right. This is the main focal point of the car, so I really want it to shut nice and smooth. Going to beef up the frame a bit and see how it reacts to that. Robert, I do have a steel square tube inner frame mounted to the fiberglass inner door. It's strong, but I think I need to re-enforce it a bit. Thanks for the input all! This door building part is killing me, but I'm going to get it right before I do anything else.
Edit: just measured the play and with the door up, I've got about 3/4 inch movement from side to side. Not nearly as bad as I was thinking. Going to tackle a little triangulation fab to get this thing as stiff as possible. Also, the hinge itself is bolted (4 bolts) to a mounting plate so I can remove it and re-pin it in the future. It doesn't move but I can see a little flex at the pin. I think new ones will take out some more of the slop I'm encountering.
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Edit: just measured the play and with the door up, I've got about 3/4 inch movement from side to side. Not nearly as bad as I was thinking.
If you are saying you have 3/4" movement of the end of the door where the latch is, that is WAY TOO MUCH!
Anything more that 1/3 the diameter of the taper pin at the latch could be a misalignment that will bang the latch when closing the door.
If that movement comes from just the hinge pivot you HAVE to fix that. If it is from a collection of locations and flexing, step your way through and fix one at a time until ALL causes are fixed.
You can't live with that much movement on the door.
You can do it.
RT
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Thanks RT. It is coming from the hinge pin, so by the end of the week, I should have new pins in. But it's also coming from the the frame itself. Just need to beef it up a little. Like you said, little by little and one thing at a time. I'm determined this thing is going to work correctly.