Author Topic: over heating  (Read 6936 times)

Digibeam

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Re: over heating
« Reply #21 on: May 08, 2014, 09:31:51 PM »
Usually he would find that interesting froth of oil mix in the rad water or an unusual amount of white smoke from the exhaust with the head gasket wouldn't he? 
Maybe more if it was a cracked head I guess.... Anyways... Carry on.   ::K

Robert

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Re: over heating
« Reply #20 on: May 08, 2014, 04:54:04 PM »
I was just thinking, fast over heating can be caused by a blown head gasket, or a cracked head. Do a compression test, the cylinders should all be fairly close in psi. Pull all the plugs out when you do it, make sure your battery is fully charged.
Before you do the compression test, look for bubbles coming into the over flow tank, this is a easy way to see if cumbustion gases are entering the cooling system. Check for bubbles at idle, and 2000 rpm.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2014, 09:50:37 AM by Robert »
Robert, Journeyman experimental mechanic, Journeyman experimental painter.

notnilc20

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Re: over heating
« Reply #19 on: May 07, 2014, 11:21:51 PM »
That's a nice looking ride. Putting a shroud on will help tremendously.

timmer

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Re: over heating
« Reply #18 on: May 07, 2014, 09:52:13 PM »
I really want to thank everyone for their help and thoughts,   I am getting a bigger fan and shroud to pull the air out of the rad and place the other fan in the front of the rad to push the air along with the natural flow of the air..   Looking at the electric water pump ,  im told it is big enough to do the job..  I know we got air in the lines somewhere and will get it out and hope all the changes work,  I love this car and want to drive it,  not look at it only..    I was asked to post more pics and will do so...  you guys are great... would be
awesome to just sit around an have a few cocktails with you all and just have some fun..
I will let you know how it goes next week.. 
Thanks
Tim

tonypaul

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Re: over heating
« Reply #17 on: May 06, 2014, 05:26:13 PM »
BTW- are you running anykind of ignition box like a MSD or Mallory/ect?

If your running a electric water pump- The flow rate varys accoring to the manufacture specs. Since the electric waterpumps flow the same rate all the time, you have to make sure your getting the right amount of flow to cool the engine properly. Not too fast and not to slow. You can get these "water restrictors" from any hotrod shop there really cheap like $10-$15. They come in sets containting these thin looking large washers that replace your thermostat with different size holes in them. This can sometimes take awhile to get right- but you start off with the middle size hole and test it out. It might take a couple trys to get the right one that gets the proper flow.

Forgot to add incase you havnt checked: - what temp is the fan set to come on/off. Make sure your thermostat is working properly and if you have a electric water pump make sure there is a small hole drilled in the outer ring of the thermostat to let water pass thru whlie the thermostat is closed.

As mentioned the cheaper (china made) are not very good. I had on on my sbc and it went out in about a year and a half after I bought it. But on mine the electric motor went out on mine, the pump will sound different kinda a rattling sound when it goes out. Get a good name brand electric water pump.....
 
Also mentioned, the timing its a real good idea to check it, super important if you car has a hard time starting or anykind of dieseling when you shut it down or any kind of popping/backfiring thru the carb/TB. Also you can also check your ignition advance springs inside you distributor to make sure your getting the proper advancing thru your powerband if you have a standard HEI.

You can also remove the lower rad hose from the rad, jack up the front of the car as much as you can and put your water hose in the rad. Start filling the rad (fairly quickly/ plent of water pressure) till the water starts comming out of the lower
rad hose. This is to check to make sure you have no kind of blockage. Then do the same test on the rad, check out the flow to see if it has the same amount of flow coming out as going in.

Im sorry I failed to mention: The main reason I run my engine cooler (160ish-180ish) than most is because Im not on a factory ECU. I have stand alone engine management and transmission mangement and I run E85 fuel. Im able to adjust my VE and ignition map tables to compensate for the slighty cooler engine. On a fuel injected sbc engine I would go with a 190 degree thermostat, carbed I would go with a 180.

I personaly feel from the issues you spoke off, you have a combination of a bad setup on your electric fan and maybe waterpump failure.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2014, 05:31:17 PM by tonypaul »

LP640

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Re: over heating
« Reply #16 on: May 05, 2014, 04:00:47 PM »
My rad is mounted similar although mine is more of at an angle up. Also there is room for the fan air to escape. My setup is dead simple and works. I drive it like hell no overheating.

01Lambiero

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Re: over heating
« Reply #15 on: May 05, 2014, 10:14:01 AM »
Below is the water pump I used (similar)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Big-Block-Chevy-Red-Electric-Water-Pump-396-427-454-BBC-V8-Chevrolet-HP-/380606207470?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item589de5d5ee&vxp=mtr

Thanks
CCIE
PS post more pic and if you have any questions that I can help just email me
Yusha_2000@yahoo.com


My past experience with cheap (under $150) electric water pumps is that they are junk.  After one year the seal leaks and they are NOT REPAIRABLE.  Buy a quality water pump like Meziere or CSR.  CSR also makes an inline pump to aid the oem pump on your engine. 

Your cooling system should be able to handle any variance in the ignition timing.  (too advanced: hard starting/too retarded: sluggish and no performance) 

210 degrees is NOT overheating.  Your average driver today runs in the 210 range.  240 degrees is overheating.  Past experience is that 180 degrees is just barely warm to an engine.  If you are using a 15# cap, your coolant will boil at 257 degrees.  Jim
« Last Edit: May 05, 2014, 10:25:15 AM by 01Lambiero »
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aeauto

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Re: over heating
« Reply #14 on: May 05, 2014, 10:02:55 AM »
The timing issue had crossed my mind too and would be a good thing to have checked.  You might also think about installing a header tank as a high point near the engine and do you filling there.  It will be a place for air to accumulate and get it out of the system.

Digibeam

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Re: over heating
« Reply #13 on: May 05, 2014, 12:04:13 AM »
that was excellent information for everyone actually....another thought that crossed my mind was timing, its a long shot but it can make a big difference in temp also.

tonypaul

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Re: over heating
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2014, 09:57:02 PM »
Got your email and thought I would respond here-

When I had my sbc with the Fiero 5 speed I only had the 2 rear Griffin rads in the back with Spal fans plus 1 electric waterpump on the motor and one in between the 2 rads and it cooled great. Now with my LS4 it was cooling just fine but once I added a/c and now a turbo it was having trouble staying at 180 degrees in heavy traffic during hot days. It would also get hot if I was driving it hard, it would climb up to 200-210 and not ever come back done until I stopped the car and let it cool back down.

I like this car to run no more than 180 degrees, the heat soak thru the cabin just gets too much even with Fatmat everywhere. What I have done is put a intercooler (like people use for turbos) between the rear cabin firewall and the motor down a little bit low with 2 small 7" electric fans. This is the one I used:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/140584269021?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649

I hooked it up to my heater core lines (dont need a heater in the summer) and wired the 2 small fans to a couple relays and have it coming on via my brake light switch. That way it only comes on when Im sitting in traffic/stop light/ect basicly when my airflow is low. Plus I have a master switch/button that I can turn it on at anytime I need, but havnt needed to yet. I run a 180 degree thermostat with a small 1/4ish" hole drilled in it, my car will run 160ish degrees in the mornings when its cool outside (fans are set to come on at 160) and never over 185 in heat no matter how I drive it. I just tried to take a pic of this small rad/intercooler but it was too dark, I will take one tomorrow. I no longer run the 2nd electric waterpump only the factory LS4 waterpump, but I might hook up the 2nd inline electric waterpump to my intercooler/rad thing if I see it starting to run any warmer once the Texas 105+ degrees summers kick in.

Depending on how much money you want to spend you could change to 2 rear mounted rads, I might provide better cooling but personaly I would just keep the front mount for now.

I didnt read all the responces to your post but this is what I would do if it were my car:
A: First find someone who has a temperture gun, go over everything. Check to see if the rad/each cylinder/different parts of the motor to make sure there isnt a big temperture difference.
B: Get a second temp gauge (harbor friengt has them around $15.00) put into the motor somewhere, either the heads or intake. You will have to remove a plug somewhere to do this. When I first put in my sbc it was running hot, but come to find out the temperture sending unit wasnt the right one for my gauge.

If none of that works-
#1. Make sure I got a real good rad up front, made for a V8, preferable a aluminum rad.
#2. When the car is cold (not started that day) I would jack up the car on the waterpump side of the as high as I could get it. Remove the the thermostat housing and the thermostat, fill the motor thru the hole in the intake as much as you can.
#3. remove the rad cap and fill as much as you can, till the coolant starts coming out of the thermostat hole in the intake..
#4. Let it sit for 30 minutes and refill again while the car is still jacked up.
#5. Put back the thermostat and housing and rad cap, get your water hose turn it on a little and fill the upper hose as much as you can and quickly attach it to the thermostat housing. Try to get as much coolant/water in the the hose to get in the cooling system.

For sure you need to put that electric fan on the back of the rad, make sure the fan is turning the right way. You should be able to put a piece of heavy cardboard on the front of the rad and the electric fan should hold the cardboard in place while on.

I couldnt tell from your description what kind of waterpump you have, electric or belt driven. But if your running a electric waterpump- Make sure you have good 12v to the pump. Make sure its wired to come on with the key. And make sure there is a small hole drilled into the thermostat so coolant can pass thru even if the thermostat is closed. Drop the car off the jack and take it for a test drive.


If you have a belt driven water pump- I would go ahead and change it out to a good name brand performance high volume water pump. Cant hurt... Another thing to check is the wiring on the fan itself. you want a heavy gauge wire for the main power feed. Sometimes people/builders will use smaller wire and a cheap relay for the fan... You also need to check the airway to the rad, making sure you have good, unblocked airflow directly to the rad. Second you need to make sure the air has a good way of getting out. Airflow in and OUT is super important. Its best if you have some kind of wind deflector on the bottom of the rad to push air upto the rad.

If all this fails to improve your cooling, next do a leak down test on the motor to check for a bad head gasket. Also with the car running check the back of the exhaust to make sure no kind of moisture is comming out.

After you do all these test/replacing/checking and your still over heating get back to me and I will try to come up with something else.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2014, 10:09:14 PM by tonypaul »

CCIE

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Re: over heating
« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2014, 12:23:10 PM »
Nice....... Some one else with a Diablo......  WELCOME!!!

I have a Ferrari F40 with a Corvette v8... Had the same issue of overheating. I had my mechanic try a lot of different thing (lots of $$$$) There are several thing you have to think about... Is your Radiator big enough, Can your fan push/pull enough air and are you moving enough coolant through your system. If you have your Rad in the front you need to make sure your water pump is strong enough. I have a 35G electric pump and do not have a heating issue.
I also have a Diablo 60 with a Corvette v8 setup and same coolant setup but it is overheating. I did change the thermostat and things were working fine. I also have a engine cover on top which is restricting airflow so I am going to put 2 fans in the rear to pull air out of the engine bay (I do not have the RAD's in the rear) Hopefully it will allow me to still have the engine cover and run cool.
I also have a Diablo roadster and getting a Corvette v8 TPI dropped in it now, I intend to do the same setup with a rad in front and 2 fans in the rear (to pull the air out of the engine bay, also duct the air in from the side air inlet and possibly put fans there as well) Of course using an aluminum 4 core RAD and strong water pump (remember the coolant has to travel all the way from the rear to the front and the original Fiero water pump wont be able to handle it)
Conclusion...... There are three component you have to look... A big Aluminum 4 core Rad. Strong electric water pump and Patience)

Below is the water pump I used (similar)
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Big-Block-Chevy-Red-Electric-Water-Pump-396-427-454-BBC-V8-Chevrolet-HP-/380606207470?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item589de5d5ee&vxp=mtr

Thanks
CCIE
PS post more pic and if you have any questions that I can help just email me
Yusha_2000@yahoo.com
« Last Edit: May 04, 2014, 12:28:11 PM by CCIE »

notnilc20

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Re: over heating
« Reply #10 on: May 03, 2014, 10:12:37 PM »
Whoa!  I don't see a fan shroud on there first of all. Second of all, if that fan is pushing the air toward the front, then you should turn the fan around so it is pulling the air through and working with the natural flow of air while the car is in motion and not pushing it back. That's if i'm seeing things correctly. Anyone else?

timmer

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Re: over heating
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2014, 09:38:14 PM »
forgot to add the pic of the rad and fan

timmer

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Re: over heating
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2014, 09:36:37 PM »
Guys I really thank you all for your input..  im going to answer some of the questions, 
the radidator size is 23 x 20 x 3  ,  now I am not sure if all the air is out of the lines,  I just had it delivered to me on Sunday not even had it a week.   My garage guy is willing to do whatever it takes.. but he is scraching his head thinking what to do..  I am adding a pic of the rad and fan ,   now the question we were thinking with the air coming up from the bottom of the car, and currently the fan is blowing into the rad,  with the air coming up under the rad should the fan pull the air away ? like reverse the fan direction ..? 

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