I want to apologize to everyone here for my misleading diagram on to how to make an effective batwing drive.  I don’t know what I was thinking.
There were some here who knew immediately that I was way off base and called me out on that.  Murci-me recognized the system I proposed was really “Rube Goldberg”.  That was very perceptive.
So I considered again the problem of how to make the batwings move with an eye on simplicity.  I think I “hit it” this time.
Please review this revised method and maybe someone can incorporate it into their build.
Thanks again for your patience with this issue.

RT




Here is an explanation of how it works:
“A” Pull string on dash
“B” Cat is released from cage
“C” Mouse sees cat and runs up tube which tilts and releases golf ball
“D” Golf ball rolls down ramp and lands on lever on bucket of water
 â€śE” Bucket tips pouring water through funnel into tank
“F” Tank fills causing float to rise with linkage releasing bowling ball
“G” Bowling ball pushes swing arm with match and lights candle
“H” Candle burns through string, releases hammer, strikes button switch
“I” Fan blows ship across water
“J” Ship hits barrel rolling it down ramp
“K” Barrel starts domino effect
“L” Domino hits meat cleaver and cuts string
“M” Cut string releases weight, pulling string
“N” String pull levers pushing up batwings

I paid $8 each at the junkyard for the window motors. These motors rarely (if at all) fail, and since they only make 1/2 revolution, they will last longer than the car lol. The lever ataches directly to the drive of the motor, and an adjustable link goes from the arm to the wing. The whole set-up is about 6" long. It is designed to stop the motor mechanically in the up and down position, not electronically. The system is controlled by a single momentary switch, and a single DPDT relay.

OK, so you mounted two motors, made two adjustable linkages and control it with a momentary switch and a relay.  This gives you a manually activated drive only and while using a momentary switch you somehow change direction of the batwings so they go down too.
There is no electric limit switch to turn the electric power off to the drive so it is possible to continue powering the motor at end of travel and you rely on a mechanical stop to prevent over-travel. 
The batwings do not open when the cooling system requires, only when you want them to open.
My suggestion requires only one motor drive, the addition of two end of travel switches, two more relays, and a cross shaft to match your system.  Add a temperature switch and they will work like they are supposed to.
I guess that would be too complicated to make them work like they should.
I'm glad you like your batwings and I'm sure they work just fine.
You really need to be more open to ideas and see them for their worth.

RT

Quote from: apsara on June 04, 2013, 11:40:40 AM

you have too many parts that will fail during use. why not keep things simple and just use an electronic actuator? just daisy chain both of them together, hook it up to a switch and power supply and your done.

BINGO!
All this talk of linkage and sway bars and 3 relay systems with timers and temperature switches is far to complicated, its like re-inventing the wheel. Remember, "KISS" (keep it simple stupid)

The temperature control will make the batwings do what they are supposed to do: open when needed.
The relays provide a simple way to have them return to closed position when they are not required.
The manuals switch is for those who want to "play".  I explained the timer, only suggested IF you use a manual switch.
The cross shaft drive will keep the batwing motion synchronized and only require one motor.  Independent motor drives might not move equally.
Good, sound, mechanical construction will not fail any more than any factory builds which are far more complicated.

RT

jdinner,
How did you know that?  I DO have a hard time falling to sleep.  I thought it was insomnia.
I'm just afraid there isn't enough time in life to do everything I want to do.
I have this design for an automatic transmission for a bicycle where you dial in how hard you want to pedal and it adjust for you.  All the parts are available over the counter.
I want to build a three-wheeled recumbent bike that you want to ride as soon as you see it.  (It is really unique and different that anything you have ever seen)
I have a new design for a racing bicycle and the proper attire that will give you a big advantage.
My ideas aren't limited to bicycles, that is just my current trend.
I can't stop myself but it is fun.
Thanks for the compliments.
Now on to what everybody else does for a living.

RT

apsara, you posted:
"it requires alot of time and a specialized frame machine to do that.  I don't think there is even a machine out there designed to do that." 

The builders here don't use a "specialized frame machine"  to lengthen their chassis.  This is usually home garage ingenuity at work and they turn out just fine.  You need to trust that builders will not make anything unsafe for their use.
Some builders make a complete home-built chassis and they probably don't use any specialized frame machine.  Widening a chassis will require the same skills as lengthening.  Done properly, it can offer its own advantages.  I would not suggest anyone try this without good skill sets and ability.

"Theres really no point in widening a car, all you really need to do is just make new longer control arms."

Anyone who makes new control arms better have good fabrication skills.  Without proper construction they could fail with disastrous results.

I appreciate your comments.  They come from someone who has solved their own construction problem the way they knew how and it works for you.

This hobby is all about innovation and solving problems.  Sometimes we have to think outside the box.

RT

I am retired from designing industrial machinery (heat treating furnaces, automated de-flashing machines, tool and die, specialized equipment) and later in my career, technical illustrating for military technical manuals.
Now I get to design (and build) stuff for me.

RT

Welcome to the chaos!
I hope you know what you are getting yourself into.
It won't be easy.  It won't be quick.  And it won't be cheap.
01Lambiero is correct about the cost.
Don't start unless we can't possibly talk you out of it.
But if you insist, good luck to you and stay here and at www.kitcentral.com for all the advice you need.

RT

Here is a post I put on kitcentral a while ago about “Why replicas cost so much.

http://www.kitcentral.com/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=9352&postdays=0&postorder=asc&sid=f699dfbb4f078d8e78b77e78987246dc

Read through the posts and get an idea of what you are in for when you take on building a replica.  If you want the “most accurate replica” be ready for the reality.

Here is a post I put at kitcentral about the replica industry.

I am a builder of my personal Diablo. I understand about the costs.
There have been many discussions here about how expensive these cars are, especially compared to the cost of a used Diablo.
People used to take an old Fiero and attach a fiberglass replica Countach body to it. Flat windshield, plastic side windows that don't go down. Easy.
But then the Diablo came out. So it was off and running. The Fiero now had a Diablo body. Then the call was for an interior to match the Diablo. And of course you should have all the real lights and emblems. While they are at it, the suppliers should really make the angle of that body panel better, it is off by a degree or two. And make that bumper opening a little wider, it isn't perfect yet. C'mon guys get it right! It just means making the mold over, how hard is that?
Now we need to get performance, better than the old 4 cylinder or V6. Make sure the wheels and tires are as accurate as possible. On to better windshields and side glass 'cause the plastic windows and cut-down van windshield aren't good enough. And ya'know, that Fiero suspension isn't good either so let's make better parts. Even with a stretched Fiero chassis, it takes so much work to do that (and it is an old design anyway), you might as well make your own frame with better suspension and brakes. We can't all make a frame so let's buy one from someone who knows how.
More parts from the supplier 'cause we can't be expected to make them all! Now we go to an inline V8 with transaxle. YeeHaa! Better interior covering and gauges! Replica engines! NOW we're talking! These things are almost REAL!
And so is the cost.
I have been caught up in this also. I have spent an awful lot of money just for the parts to make mine look authentic. All the little things add up. Then there is the time it takes to replicate, with perfection, all the details. This is a HOBBY for those who build their own. You have to have the disposable time and money. It is not about making a cheap Diablo.
These are the most difficult replicas to build and will require a lot of time and money. You only get what you pay for.
For those who take on the task of building these cars for customers, I have a lot of respect and wonder how they can make them so inexpensive.
The building is the fun, the reward is a fantastic car.

RT